VWER Meeting Transcripts by Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivs 3.0 Unported License.
Based on a work at www.vwer.org.
Transcript of the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable May 26, 2011
Topic: Making Movies (Machinima tips & resources)
Hardware & Software Tools Noted:
- The Freesound Project: http://freesound.org
- Rhiannon Chatnoir’s screen-capture picks for Mac OS: IshowU (http://shinywhitebox.com/ishowu-v1/) or Snapz (http://www.ambrosiasw.com/utilities/snapzprox/)
- Screencast-o-matic for Windows, Mac OS, and Linux: http://www.screencast-o-matic.com
- http://www.fraps.com/ (screen capture recommeneded by Sheila Yoshikawa)
- Sheila’s choice for free music: http://www.jamendo.com/en/ and Grinn Pidgeon’s: http://incompetech.com/m/c/royalty-free/
- Audacity sound editor: http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
- Camtasia screen recorder (Mac OS and Windows): http://www.techsmith.com/camtasia/
- Space Navigator Mouse http://www.3dconnexion.com/buy/shop.html?3dxcp=GA_search_google_US_SN
- Game Salad Game-Making App: http://gamesalad.com/
Design & Copyright Advice:
- The 180 degree rule http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/180_degree_rule (thanks to Decka Mah)
- Knowclue Kidd’s resource links: http://knowclue.wikispaces.com/Machinima+Through+Multiple+Lenses & http://knowclue-machinima.wikispaces.com/Resources
- Machinima-Friendly Sims in Second Life: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Machinima_Friendly_Sims
- Linden Lab’s advice from its wiki: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Machinima
- Tales from the Public Domain: Bound by Law? http://www.law.duke.edu/cspd/comics/
- Torley Linden’s advice: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Movie_help
- SL Groups to Join: machnimatographers, mamachinima, macinima institute
VWER Participants’ Machinima & Recommendations:
- Sheila Yoshikawa: http://www.screenr.com/user/sheilayoshikawa & animoto example http://animoto.com/play/zAEFwWobZxM4i7kNxA5P6A
- Robbie Dingo’s “Watch the World(s)”: http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/2007/07/watch-worlds.html (rec. by Ignatius Onomatopoeia)
- Hypatia Pickens’ “KAPHD”: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbPuhy4AyM4&feature=player_embedded (rec. by LoCE99Ch8 Morpork)
- “World of Warcraft-Here Without You.” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fb5LIo6HE6Y (rec. by Decka Mah)
- “True Colors (glee) Music Video” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8_K2KPJquM&feature=youtu.be (rec. by Knowclue Kidd)
- Machinima Fest 2011: http://sigve.iste.wikispaces.net/Machinima+Fest+2011
- “Pixelated Truth” by Arbit Delecroix http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wj-l1-ItB4 (rec. by D’lightful)
- “Possibilities of an MMO” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiWis3I3O-E&feature=youtu.be (rec. by Ignatius Onomatopoeia)
- Machinima work Global Kids has done with their youth educational programs: http://www.olpglobalkids.org/virtual_worlds/machinima/ (rec. by Rhiannon Chatnoir)
- Grizzla Pixelmaid’s screen captures of colleagues’ builds: http://capture.ggc.edu:8080/ess/echo/presentation/c63ea94d-6b30-42cf-987f-429530cdfd44
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hello everyone and welcome to the Virtual Worlds Education Rountable!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: We meet each Thursday at 2:30pm SLT for an hour here on the Bowling Green State University’s virtual campus.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: We have met every week for over three years. We hope to be able to continue to do so, but we need help from the community.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Today’s Topic is “Making Movies”: Tips and Resources for machinima.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: We are looking for moderators for some of our regular weekly meetings. Details can be found here: http://www.vwer.org/?p=1093
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Each week we get a wide variety of educators, from seasoned veterans to the newly rezzed.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: The Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable is a forum to educate and inform the community about issues that are important and relevant to education.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: This is a public meeting, so we will be keeping and publishing a transcript of what is said in local chat. If you’ve not seen our transcripts, you should check them out – they are an excellent information asset.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: The transcripts can be found at our web site – http://www.vwer.org – select the LIBRARY tab at the top.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Please join the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable group here in SL. If you are on Facebook, please join our group there – Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: You can also find and post pictures to our Flickr and Koinup groups and follow us on Twitter @VWER. When you blog or tweet, please remember to include the tag #vwer
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Aside from our regular meetings in Second Life, as of last year, the Virtual Worlds Education Roundtable started its own grid, which is being hosted by ReactionGrid.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Those on ReactionGrid, or on the same version of OpenSim, can hypergrid over to the VWERGrid.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: If you are affiliated with an educational institution, you are also welcome to create your own account on the VWERGrid.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Information on how to get to the grid and/or create an account can be found at our web site – http://www.vwer.org under the VWERGrid option in the top toolbar.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: One last thing. We’d love to get your opinion about several VWER issues including meeting times and volunteering.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Please visit this short survey and give us your input. That survey is located at http://bit.ly/jsbd97
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’ll repeat that: please do that survey 😀
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’m Joe Essid, Writing Center Director at the University of Richmond. I’m designing an immersive literary build
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: based on Poe’s “Fall of the House of Usher” in Jokaydia Grid.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: So, lets get started and introduce ourselves.
Grinn Pidgeon: Barbara Pittman, Cuyahoga Community College, Cleveland, Ohio. Faculty Development/Instructional technology/English adjunct
Margaret Michalski: Margaret, Univ. of Illinois at Chicago, Research Information Specialist
Sheila Yoshikawa: I’m on the faculty at the iSchool at the University of Sheffield, UK
Rk Jinn: Rk Jinn, Rick Anderson Rutgers University
Kali Pizzaro: Evelyn McElhinney Glasgow Caledonian University RN, Nurse Lecturer
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Chris Robinson, Virtual Assistant, Georgia Gwinnett College
Samantha Chester (sam55.chester): I am Ashlyn Dugan I teach Writing and Composition at National Park Community College In Hot Springs , Arkansas
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: others?
Decka Mah: Lindy (McKeown) Orwin (just married) and new job at University of New England in Australia managing a project for Social Work and Counselling
Knowclue Kidd: ola
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: WOOT Decka! Congratulations
Sheila Yoshikawa: congrats Decka
Decka Mah: ty Shiela
Corbinian Baggage (corbinianbaggage): Corbinian Baggage, wanderer wanting to learn about machinima
Kali Pizzaro: fab welcome Corbinian
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: others? Don’t be shy
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: no one could fumble more than I’m doing, running a meeting on a viewer new to me.
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Barbara Truman, Center for Distributed Learning, Univ of Central FL, Orlando
Kali Pizzaro: on my way there Delightful
Kali Pizzaro: Orlando ;0
Rhiannon Chatnoir: /me Joyce Bettencourt, co-own Vesuvius Group, a dev group that does edu simulation/media work for the nonprofit Global Kids, along with edu projects with Georgia Tech & ASU
Kali Pizzaro: Hi Knowclue
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): @Kali do come and see us
Kali Pizzaro: come have a seat
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: okies, let’s start then….
Kali Pizzaro: i ish i could fit it in
Knowclue Kidd: Hello
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’m a novice to machinima, but last week
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: we had several requests to do a meeting on the topic
Decka Mah: waves to Knowclue
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I do teach film studies and make digital films, so today
Samantha Chester (sam55.chester): @ Rhiannon By ASU do you mean Augusta State?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I hope we can share tips and ideas for resources
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: let’s begin with this question
Rhiannon Chatnoir: oh sorry.. Arizona State Univ
Knowclue Kidd: @Decka Bachatcha Sista!
Kali Pizzaro: hi esme
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: how many of you have made machinima? Answer yes or no
Samantha Chester (sam55.chester): No
Rk Jinn: no
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Sort of
Kali Pizzaro: no
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes
Decka Mah: yes
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes, though nothing complex
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: no
Esme Qunhua: Hi Kali Thanks.
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): not yet
Kali Pizzaro: well not fancy
Grinn Pidgeon: yes
Knowclue Kidd: Hello Esme!
Grinn Pidgeon: just tutorials
Esme Qunhua: Hey KC
Knowclue Kidd: yes
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Too bad Normal (who was here last week) isn’t here. I looked at his machinima this week and it was good!
Kali Pizzaro: havea seat knowclue next to corbinian
Esme Qunhua: Knowclue is a master of machinima
Knowclue Kidd: just waiting to fully rez… little sluggish
Corbinian Baggage (corbinianbaggage): Yes keep me company
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: To those who answered “yes”: What is the one resource (aside from SL) that you like best when making machinima? Add URLs if you have them
Kali Pizzaro: woo def have a seat
Sheila Yoshikawa: what do you mean by resource?
Decka Mah: The SL marketplace
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: well, Sheila, I mean
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Software, hardware
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: something like my use of Freesound at http://freesound.org
Kali Pizzaro: Loc come on in
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: that I’m using at Usher for CC-licensed sounds
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Knowclue, tell us a bit about that link and what you use it for
Knowclue Kidd: http://knowclue-machinima.wikispaces.com/Resources
LoCE99Ch8 Morpork: Thanks. I’m waiting for the spare chair to rez…or does this set-up work differently?
Knowclue Kidd: I use iShowU
Kali Pizzaro: no there is one next to Sheila
Knowclue Kidd: 4 mac
LoCE99Ch8 Morpork: Ah, yes
Kali Pizzaro: 16 for the transcript
Knowclue Kidd: affordable, real time capture
Knowclue Kidd: easy interface
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: cool. Got a link?
Knowclue Kidd: just dropped it in chat
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod to Knowclue
Knowclue Kidd: http://knowclue-machinima.wikispaces.com/Resources
Rhiannon Chatnoir: to
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’ll aggregate the links at the top of the transcript when we run it (I found my chat log)
Grinn Pidgeon: I use Snapz Pro and iMovie to edit
Knowclue Kidd: Snapz use to take time to render… is it still that way?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: URLs please?
Knowclue Kidd: I lost shots
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Seems like part of the challenge is to get really good music too
Knowclue Kidd: and a recall memory hog
Sheila Yoshikawa: i’ve used http://www.jamendo.com/en/ for free music
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes, it saves a temp file as it shoots and then renders after when you go to save
Grinn Pidgeon: snapz Pro does take time–walk away
Esme Qunhua: So KC iShow doesn’t take time to render?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: excellent link, Sheila…finding a soundtrack poses all sorts of IP issues
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Viv had to call in a friend to do one for the machinima she made of our first Usher build
Knowclue Kidd: no.. and it is much much much easier on the system
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): I started out using Echo360 but it’s too simple. Yesterday someone gave me Camtasia.
Knowclue Kidd: space wise
Sheila Yoshikawa: I have been using screenr to capture up to 5 mins of bideo, but the last times I tried to use it most of the time it wouldn’t publish the item
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod.. camtasia is also good
Knowclue Kidd: really important when you are working with kids
Sheila Yoshikawa: so i am sort of giving up on it and i just bought fraps
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): fraps?
Grinn Pidgeon: some music here: http://incompetech.com/m/c/royalty-free/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Is Audacity any use to your machinima makers? My students loved it for digital stories.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you can run into problems on a pc sometimes because audio/video aren’t necessarily as easy to capture at once
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): I’ve used it in the past for editing audio files, haven’t tried to combine them with video
Rhiannon Chatnoir: Ignatius, if you are say using a lot of voice over then Audacity would work
Grinn Pidgeon: we have camtasia at work but I haven’t tried it
Knowclue Kidd: i had a friend recommend: http://www.screencast-o-matic.com, but I haven’t used it
Sheila Yoshikawa: ditto grizzla,
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): (audacity)
Kali Pizzaro: i had fraps but now have screenr – is that debut video capture
Kali Pizzaro: i think it downleads as
Kali Pizzaro: loads
Kali Pizzaro: yea that above screen o matic
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): http://audacity.sourceforge.net/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: any other tools you folks really like?
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Is there any software for storyboarding as well for machinima?
Knowclue Kidd: yes
Sheila Yoshikawa: i have the priced version of fraps, so you aren’t time limited like with screenr, but you have to have the capacity on your computer. I must say it took very little time indeed to work out how to use it, more of a problem has been getting into a format i can upload and share
Knowclue Kidd: iShowU has a compressor tool I use in post production called stomp
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): I have iShowU on my home Mac. Trying to figure out if I like it or Camtasia better.
Knowclue Kidd: It cleans up the video nicely, especially after it comes out of iMovie
Sheila Yoshikawa: I’m using Windows Movie Maker to edit and save to different formats and compress, but it isn’t my fave software… i only just started using it
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: put in URLs for any of these if you have not done so already
Knowclue Kidd: seems to always lose resolution… and it also compresses it for fast download
Sheila Yoshikawa: http://www.fraps.com/
Knowclue Kidd: everything is on my resource page: http://www.screencast-o-matic.com/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: except Movie Maker and iMovie of course…we should already have those
Knowclue Kidd: whoops.. not that one
Knowclue Kidd: /me blushes
Knowclue Kidd: http://knowclue-machinima.wikispaces.com/Resources
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: /me edits these Knowclue….no need to blush 🙂
Grinn Pidgeon: great resource
Knowclue Kidd: whew
Knowclue Kidd: 😀
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): http://shinywhitebox.com/ishowu-v1/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: now I didn’t come prepared to a ton of questions, but
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): http://www.techsmith.com/camtasia/
Kali Pizzaro: oh grizzla had to read that twice
Kali Pizzaro: lol
Knowclue Kidd: BTW… i buy the cheep version for my school (not pro)
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): read what twice? I was looking up urls
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: can we share one tip for making effective machinima?
Kali Pizzaro: shiny
Kali Pizzaro: thought it said something else
Decka Mah: Follow the 180 degree rule http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/180_degree_rule
Sheila Yoshikawa: these are my screenrs, but in fact a lot of them i use as raw footage to make animoto shows: http://www.screenr.com/user/sheilayoshikawa & animoto example http://animoto.com/play/zAEFwWobZxM4i7kNxA5P6A
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: LOL Kali…you sound like Viv!
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): My tip is, don’t try to record when there’s a lot of other demand on the server.
Kali Pizzaro: Sheila how did you get so good at this
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I know that I had my digital-story students prepare a story-arc first. I’d certainly do the same for a short film.
Knowclue Kidd: one of the best tricks I learned from my kids
Kali Pizzaro: ?
Sheila Yoshikawa: I don’t think i know enough to give tips – but trying it through several times for timing, also with the animotos, interspersing images with short bits of text to tell a story
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod Grizzla, and also on your own end, video takes a lot of resoures, so make sure to have enough hard drive space to save everything you are recording
Knowclue Kidd: it made me do a palm slap because I had been struggling with the problem for a year …
Sheila Yoshikawa: actually, i think having a structure and story even if it’s short and non-fiction
Knowclue Kidd: set your capture for a lower rate… we do 25fps
Grinn Pidgeon: take a lot of extra footage so you can edit into something coherent
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Really – wow
Decka Mah: another tip is to actually say the script so you get the shot length rigth if you are doing a voice over and also if someone else is doing post production, they know what shots go where
Knowclue Kidd: it will save space and make a smoother feel
Kali Pizzaro: yes that is a good tip Decka
Kali Pizzaro: i do that is doing slides on video
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: 18 on the sim, for the transcript
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Speaking of smoothness – the SL cam can be jerky when you try to zoom or pan. Any way to smooth it out, or is that a function of my hardware?
Grinn Pidgeon: we need like buttons on the chat
Sheila Yoshikawa: lol yes Grinn
Decka Mah: Grizzla you can use a Space Navigator 3D mouse
Knowclue Kidd: 😀
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Grinn, that’s rather Facebooky 🙂
Corbinian Baggage (corbinianbaggage): Are Space Navigators expensive?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: other must-have tips for novices?
Knowclue Kidd: also…. turn of camera constraints… play with panning and use speed-up or slow down in post production
Sheila Yoshikawa: Space Navigator 3D mouse-can you just get them off Amazon or something?
Decka Mah: Also there is a big difference between filming the screen and making a movie (camera angles, establishing shots, back shots, close ups etc VS one wide angled recording)
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes, Decka, I haven’t got beyond filming the screen
Knowclue Kidd: Yes… another favorite is setting your camera on the actor and letting them do the work (movement)
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): @Decka sounds like script is very important
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Like a film instead of a stage play
Decka Mah: Shiela I bought mine direct form Connxions…lemme check the site
Kali Pizzaro: Yes Decka, is there any free software lets you put it for use on an ipad without paying
Knowclue Kidd: nice
Rhiannon Chatnoir: as much as you can rough out a script and even rough storyboard of shot angles it all helps
Sheila Yoshikawa: i was just being lazy @decka
Decka Mah: @D’lightful, script adn storyboards for films that require them help. Not all machinima is a fully scripted storyboarded film though
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you can even on the quick take some SL snap shots of framing good shots as a quick storyboard
Kali Pizzaro: ah good tip
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I wish I had time and incentives to use SL with my next class…I’m teaching them the basics of camera movement and editing to do film analyses
Decka Mah: Space Navigator Mouse http://www.3dconnexion.com/buy/shop.html?3dxcp=GA_search_google_US_SN
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks, Decka
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Is this it? http://www.amazon.com/3Dconnexion-SpaceNavigator-Standard-Navigation-3DX-700028/dp/B000LB7G00/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1306447083&sr=8-1
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): $92 on Amazon
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: now without blowing our own horns, could you name a machinima that most inspired you?
Knowclue Kidd: sure… hold on
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’m nominate Robbie Dingo’s “Watch the World(s)”: http://digitaldouble.blogspot.com/2007/07/watch-worlds.html
Sheila Yoshikawa: @decka gulp awesome but also rather awesomely expensive
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it make my students see the creative potential of building in SL
Decka Mah: Knowclue’s kid’s stuff is inspiring because they make everything and get value form simple techniques
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Yes! Robbie
Decka Mah: Shiela I have the $99 version only
Knowclue Kidd: http://youtu.be/660MWfVQwT0
Knowclue Kidd: I LOVE this machinima!
Knowclue Kidd: made using sims2
Sheila Yoshikawa: @decka, ah that sounds more achievable, I was seeing the one at £300+
Knowclue Kidd: great story
Knowclue Kidd: great graphics
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: excellent. One of my students just produced one of himself in WoW.
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Cool.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: other must-sees?
Grinn Pidgeon: @iggy let us know when your students remake Hitchcock’s Rear Window
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I will, Grinn. I’ll play Raymond Burr’s role 🙂
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: that shot of him entering Jimmie Stewart’s apartment is a perfect use of perspective and camera work. I often teach that one scene
Knowclue Kidd: do you have the url? @Ignatius?
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): /me wonders if she can move farther away from Iggy without being too obvious
Kali Pizzaro: 😉
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’ll get the machinima my student did….meanwhile, other great machinima examples?
Decka Mah: I adore this one too but not SL, WOW http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fb5LIo6HE6Y
LoCE99Ch8 Morpork: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbPuhy4AyM4&feature=player_embedded
Decka Mah: note 4.5 million hits
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Do “documentaries” count as machinima?
Kali Pizzaro: Hobbs you hiding
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: here’s John’s machinima: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiWis3I3O-E&feature=youtu.be
Decka Mah: There are some great entries in the University of Western Australia machinima competition too
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Now let’s turn things over to you folks…what do you most want to know about making or using machinima?
LoCE99Ch8 Morpork: That’s where mine came from, Western Australia
Knowclue Kidd: My student last year really got into making her own music videos… fascinating to watch her progress as she learned her craft. She has an impressive hit list for a 13 year old
Knowclue Kidd: http://youtu.be/l8_K2KPJquM
Rhiannon Chatnoir: a more recent fav mahinima … it also includes editing in video footage for a nice mashup http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iw5md8RpfWs&feature=share
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Knowclue, that might be a great way to get a student interested…I can see mine being so intimidated at first
Rhiannon Chatnoir: it won one of LL’s machinima awards recently
Knowclue Kidd: you would be amazed at how fast they learn
Knowclue Kidd: SCARY fast
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): I want to learn that fast. 🙂
Knowclue Kidd: i had my 4th graders do a project this winter
Knowclue Kidd: I had thought it would take 4 weeks for them to film & do post production (on period a week)
Knowclue Kidd: they finished in two
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I hope so….many of my students struggle with multimedia because we are not a school that attracts a lot of tech-savvy kids.
Knowclue Kidd: worked together to capture and did their own post production
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: but give them a good assignment and they do learn fast.
Grinn Pidgeon: ah, 4th graders, before they have their imaginations drummed out of them
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Iggy, are there a lot of gamers?
Knowclue Kidd: yes
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and if you want to see some of the machinima work Global Kids has done with their youth educational programs… can go to http://www.olpglobalkids.org/virtual_worlds/machinima/
Knowclue Kidd: Aww Ginn! What age do you work with?
Kali Pizzaro: Oron heyy
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Grizzla, NO. My students are very careerist.. Games hurt GPA and RL networking.
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes, shifting to students, I find it tricky judging what is reasonable to expect, there is a large variation in motivation and ability as regards doing something that is tech and that is not perceived as core to the class goals
Grinn Pidgeon: old community college students
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Wow.
Oronoque Westland: hey, just getting off a video conference
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): We are an access institution, but we have a LOT of gamers
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: they play casual games only, except for a small cadre. But at $53,000 a year, they come for other reasons.
Knowclue Kidd: I see
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Really smart ones!
Oronoque Westland: and in permanent “away” status it seems grrrr
Knowclue Kidd: well… you can start small….
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I like digital stories as a way to get them to try more complicated work.
Knowclue Kidd: music videos are a fun way to start to get use to just taking the shots and learning the tools
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Ig, do they write their own stories?
StopAll Animations Red Rose: Stopping 2 animations
StopAll Animations Red Rose: Done
Rhiannon Chatnoir: if you want to get into using game design for educational projects/purposes.. a cool app is GameSalad http://gamesalad.com/
Sheila Yoshikawa: mmm I think at 18 they would want to see the connection between information management and music videos
Grinn Pidgeon: it’s true I have a digital storytelling project in every comp class, but not in SL, on web
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: 20 min left–let’s move to questions anyone has for our experts
Kali Pizzaro: yes sheila
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): I really like this song made by Arbit Delecroix http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wj-l1-ItB4
Sheila Yoshikawa: they can though do digital storytelling about information society issues and teh like, that would be relevant
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Grizzla, yes, the students do a proposal, then a narrative I and a Writing Consultant review
Grinn Pidgeon: do you have student work in groups?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: then we do the multimedia work in our Lab with a designer’s help
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: for the digital stories, they worked individually, but they did peer-critiques
Knowclue Kidd: It depends on the project… but often, yes
Knowclue Kidd: or maybe just for part of the project
Sheila Yoshikawa: in fact some of our masters students did have digital storytelling as part of their assessment, assessed on the digital stories, but it wasn’t machinima
Knowclue Kidd: Who here is a film maker in rl?
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): /me thinks home videos probably don’t count
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I think that video-editing is a leap for many of them. I did find that some students in my upper-division class had used iMovie extensively in K-12 classes. They did some great RL footage for training films about writing.
Decka Mah: NOt a film maker but had to make films for work …not got the students to make them
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I do creative media work full time
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): What I’m working on is virtual documentaries of what other institutions are doing. (Does that count as machinima?) The director of our teaching center asked me to create discipline specific presentations for different groups of faculty.
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: it helps to have a team include one cinematographer/editor, I found
Zotarah Shepherd: I have been on a rl video crew but not for a few years.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: so a combo of things, but video/film/live streaming also as part of that
Decka Mah: Grizzla…are they available publicly?
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): They will be.
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): At this point I only have a few brief clips uploaded into an Echo site.
Knowclue Kidd: so… machinima is really no different than making a regular movie
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: What are some of the legal/ethical issues about sharing student work?
Knowclue Kidd: it’s all about story.. purpose and what you want to communicate to your audience, right?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: We get signed waivers for RL shoots
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod, though less overhead than film to produce machinima
Knowclue Kidd: The advantage of taking machinima in the classroom is that it gives you a fantastic, flexible movie set
Knowclue Kidd: costumes
Knowclue Kidd: scenery
Decka Mah: Iggy there is also an issue in SL about shooting in other people’s sims
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: so do your schools require waivers? Legal contracts?
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Decka, I know LL has some stipulations about filming people’s avs; don’t know about sims
Oronoque Westland: I have seen mixed media integrating video shot in SL with media shot in the physical world
Rhiannon Chatnoir: regarding Global Kids, their youth/students sign waivers – yes
Knowclue Kidd: and it allows you to focus on film making / visual literacy in a way that is harder when the kids have to put on costumes and run around the school
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Yes I’ve heard about this, Decka. Any URL for that? I kinda read and forgot about it since I’m not teaching in SL but in OpenSim now
Knowclue Kidd: we don’t require any waivers for machinima… no kids faces
Grinn Pidgeon: do you create them in private SL spaces where you won’t be bothered by wandering avatars into your shots?
Sheila Yoshikawa: if there any photos taken of students, where you can see their faces, in real life, then we are not supposed to publish them unless the students have signed release forms
Knowclue Kidd: I put everything they do on youtube
Oronoque Westland: yes, the sims are also someone’s creation(s) so you need permission
Knowclue Kidd: yes Ginn
Decka Mah: SL wiki http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Machinima
Sheila Yoshikawa: in terms of student work, it is normally their intellectual property, so I would need their consent
Knowclue Kidd: I have them shoot in a variety of spaces
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks, Sheila. That link will go right to the top!
Knowclue Kidd: I use virtual worlds… where they build the content
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): http://capture.ggc.edu:8080/ess/echo/presentation/c63ea94d-6b30-42cf-987f-429530cdfd44
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes and i’m aware there are the rules that LL has about publishing machinima
Knowclue Kidd: or games
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: excellent resource, Decka
Sheila Yoshikawa: thanks
Knowclue Kidd: yes.. you have to be very careful about filming other peoples content
Samantha Chester (sam55.chester): sorry gotta go
Decka Mah: yes the scenery is owned in SL
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: take care, Sam
Knowclue Kidd: Why I’m a huge advocate of starting with a bare sim and letting the kids build it
Decka Mah: Oh and it is good to buy a weather system that allows you to make rain. And you can control the sun and clouds in SL (in case people didn’t know)
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’d just build my own sets, Deka. Would be easier for creative work. For documentary, however, you need to “go out there”
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: how to handle crowd scenes?
Knowclue Kidd: loll… good question
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Virtual waivers? :0)
Decka Mah: Ig there are such awesome builds in SL that leave my builds for dead, that it can be worth the time to get permission.
Knowclue Kidd: fascinating… virtual waivers
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I *think* IRL if you can identify someone in a close-up you need written permission
Decka Mah: I see lots of requests on the SLED group for crowds to help out in crowd scenes
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: but in SL well…”who is that rusty robot?”
Rhiannon Chatnoir: virtual waivers could be as easy as a google form you ask people to fill out
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): so I do need permission to do video of a college’s builds?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Grizzla, it cannot hurt to get permission
Decka Mah: actually avatars have copyright just as the sims do in SL
Sheila Yoshikawa: not to do with SL, but I like this comic book that goes through the fraught copyright issues involved in documentary film making http://www.law.duke.edu/cspd/comics/
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I’ve found that so many SLers are eager to promote their work…so I’d just ask the estate manager
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Did not know that Good to know!
Decka Mah: Torley’s guide is good too http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Movie_help
Knowclue Kidd: intresting question… but if someone captures you in a public event, isn’t that image fair game?
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: in our last 10 minutes….what have we NOT covered today?
Knowclue Kidd: /me hmmmmmm
Oronoque Westland: some sims have up signs that basically say that by entering you give permission to be recorded
Sheila Yoshikawa: @knowclue – in RL that would vary depending on what country you are in…
Knowclue Kidd: interesting
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes if you plan to do a lot of event filming of machinima good to post up something like that
Grinn Pidgeon: would be nice if there were a movie studio with props and scenery that could be reused, rented, borrowed
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): @Decka Torley allows his music to be used too
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: good to know that, Oro! I’ll behave 🙂
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): …and his textures!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: there are a few long time machinima focused groups, you can join those to ask questions and mindshare too
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Grinn, someone could start THAT SL business
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Rhiannon, any groups you’d recommend?
Oronoque Westland: that sign is often at gatherings where the chat logs are published to the web
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Great project for business students
Knowclue Kidd: there is an interesting tension between old copyright and CC and the use of mashups… media is changing
Knowclue Kidd: faschinating to watch.. anyway
Decka Mah: *nods* it is a can of worms Knowclue
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: With Peter Greenaway promoting machinima, we may see a lot more attention to this medium
Decka Mah: and a student can do things a teacher can’t under copyright laws
Knowclue Kidd: I would like to invite all of you who are making machinima… or would like to make machinima to participate in http://sigve.iste.wikispaces.net/Machinima+Fest+2011
Knowclue Kidd: we are looking for the best machinima in the education realm….
Sheila Yoshikawa: @knowclue yes, I filmed in an installation by Pixeels Sideways which was using a video from Symphony of Science on many textures and that uses clips from all sorts of TV programmes….
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: excellent, Knowclue! I’m going to have fun with all these links
Knowclue Kidd: I know some of you are making them
Knowclue Kidd: @Sheila… very cool
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: I keep thinking that machinima is that “killer app” to show non-SLers what is possible here
Sheila Yoshikawa: but a copyright nightmare!
Sheila Yoshikawa: lol
Knowclue Kidd: great… but PLEASE, do submit your machinima
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): I understand that Merlot is doing machinima with their virtual safaris, but I haven’t succeeded in finding any finished vids.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: SL groups: machnimatographers, mamachinima, macinima institute
Decka Mah: yes Ig, it is a great way to show SL outside SL.
Kali Pizzaro: there should be one
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: ty Rhiannon…those too will go with our “links of note” at the start of the transcript
Esme Qunhua: Thank you all so much. I have learned a lot from all of you!
Kali Pizzaro: think it is in the tent on clive island
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): @Iggy I agree. Machinima could be gateway
Sheila Yoshikawa: good session for links ;-))
Kali Pizzaro: sorry folks fell asleep shattered
Knowclue Kidd: BTW…. we are doing a challenge that would be a great project for everyone here to try…
Kali Pizzaro: well 2 min snooze
Sheila Yoshikawa: shattered eh Kali
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: Hamlet Au always promotes that idea…and I actually agree with him 🙂
Sheila Yoshikawa: too much marking?
Knowclue Kidd: make a 1 min or less machinima to show where you work, play or live in virtual worlds/ games
Kali Pizzaro: indeed
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: LOL Kali…two min. warning 🙂
Kali Pizzaro: that would be good knowclue
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): oooo I could do that!
Knowclue Kidd: 😀
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Possible
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: any final advice/tips/URLs?
Kali Pizzaro: done
Knowclue Kidd: http://sigve.iste.wikispaces.net/Machinima+Fest+2011
Sheila Yoshikawa: I know it’s a problem assignment when i fall asleep half way through marking it
Kali Pizzaro: hehe
Decka Mah: thanks for all the great tips and sites everyone
Kali Pizzaro: yep great as usually
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes, thanks everyone
Oronoque Westland: my “set not away” is not working…I really am not the student who is in FB when claiming to be in class
Rhiannon Chatnoir: actually, those sort of group machinima contests/projects are good to get your skill level up and collaborate with others
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: And before we break…two great meetings coming up…next week, Olivia will lead an open forum!
Grinn Pidgeon: I have about 50 tabs open in my browser now
Sheila Yoshikawa: lol oro
Knowclue Kidd: This is great… do I have your permission to share your URLs on the http://sigve.iste.wikispaces.net/Machinima+Fest+2011 site as resources????
Kali Pizzaro: well i am away for 3 weeks so look after the place fellow VWER
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: and after that, Maria Korolov will be our special guest for a voice interview with AJ
Sheila Yoshikawa: have fun in Florida Kali
Kali Pizzaro: 😉
Sheila Yoshikawa: not too much, obviously
Kali Pizzaro: and Peru wooooo
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Next time Kali, come visit
Kali Pizzaro: yep on my list Delightful
Knowclue Kidd: Thanks Kali for putting this meetup together… Kavon sent me over to participate… I appreciate all of the new resources!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: so are the other discussion times on different topics
Sheila Yoshikawa: ooo remember John Peel
Sheila Yoshikawa: don’t go keeling over, we need you Kali
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): /me doesn’t remember John Peel
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: @Rhiannon, yes, we have other topics but always at this time and location
Kali Pizzaro: hehe
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thank you all folks!
Sheila Yoshikawa: ah he was an iconic British DJ
Kali Pizzaro: mmm cocoa tea me thinks
Kali Pizzaro: hehe
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: that a great set of resources to share. I’ll flog it in my blog, too
Rhiannon Chatnoir: nod, if anyone is interested, we could start a informal collab/knowledge share group together for edu focused machinima
Rhiannon Chatnoir: 🙂
Sheila Yoshikawa: who died in Peru on holiday of a heart attack
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): And I’ll… use it all!
Maggie Quinote: Thank you! I always feel so ignorant the more I hear from the group!!! Maybe in a year I will actually understand the vocabulary!
Grinn Pidgeon: good stuff, bye
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): Rhiannon, I’d be interested
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: thanks, all of you! Grizzla, thanks for “riding shotgun” today
Knowclue Kidd: Love that there is so much interest… machinima is a great tool for education
Grizzla (grizzla.pixelmaid): /me blushes
Rhiannon Chatnoir: k
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: /me hands her the shotgun and apologies for forgetting 🙂
Jenny (silviana.jenvieve): Thank you, everyone. Sitting silently here but cutting and pasting notes furiously!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: anyone who is.. can say so.. can grab names from the transcript and can start from there 🙂
Decka Mah: thanks all bye for now
Sheila Yoshikawa: yes
Kali Pizzaro: toodle loo
Sheila Yoshikawa: byee
Knowclue Kidd: bye
Zotarah Shepherd: Bye
Jenny (silviana.jenvieve): tc all
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: got some sleep, Kali 🙂
D’lightful (delightful.doowangle): Ta ta for now
Kali Pizzaro: woop to Grizzla
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: off to nerd night for Iggy!
Kali Pizzaro: ;-0
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: see you soon
Rhiannon Chatnoir: happy nerding!
Ignatius Onomatopoeia: woo hoo face-to-face old-timey RPGs 🙂